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MAME Changes that relate to FME


Altharic
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3 hours ago, thealteredemu said:

Wow, would love to see Pluto6 just a certain few Astra lo-techs.

Great stuff :)

J

Pluto 6 would be impressive, although I guess the manufacturer specific FPGA chips will be the issue? Definitely good to see development on it. I forgot that my old JPM clubber, an Al Murray clubber based on Casino Crazy but with £400 jackpot and multi stake, used it. I assume other late JPM and Crystal club and pub machines would. Along with the usual Betcoms and similar.

I'm assuming Empire used it too once they were absorbed by Astra, so plenty of other lo-techs.

I can't remember though if the likes of Bullion BARs Streakin' used Pluto 6 or if they ran something else? I feel like they might have had a backplane arrangement like the Firefox machines? They used Firefox cabinets for sure.

Edited by slotsmagic

Happy non-gambler since 1st January 2025!
(if anyone else needs or wants to quit, I recommend Allen Carr's 'Easyway to Stop Gambling'.

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15 hours ago, slotsmagic said:

Pluto 6 would be impressive, although I guess the manufacturer specific FPGA chips will be the issue? Definitely good to see development on it. I forgot that my old JPM clubber, an Al Murray clubber based on Casino Crazy but with £400 jackpot and multi stake, used it. I assume other late JPM and Crystal club and pub machines would. Along with the usual Betcoms and similar.

Betcoms are scorp. I think most (if not all) Betcoms that have a scorp6 version will also have a scorp5 version but we have problems with a couple of those so maybe scorp6 will be a solution.

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3 hours ago, dondplayer said:

Betcoms are scorp. I think most (if not all) Betcoms that have a scorp6 version will also have a scorp5 version but we have problems with a couple of those so maybe scorp6 will be a solution.

Ah, I might have been confusing Betcom with someone else. I have a habit of lumping all the modern crap machines into the same category lol.

There's definitely been plenty of pub AWPs on Pluto 6 the last 10/15 years I'm sure, but many of them may have had Scorp 5 versions or similar?

 

(Edit - see attached for a Betcom Pluto 6 board with Paddy's PD (PayDay?) CF card)

Screenshot_20250124_115653_com_ebay_mobile_ViewItemActivity.jpg

Edited by slotsmagic
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Happy non-gambler since 1st January 2025!
(if anyone else needs or wants to quit, I recommend Allen Carr's 'Easyway to Stop Gambling'.

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I wonder if they may have more security outside of the Pluto 6 'core' emulation; from the Heber website:
 

Sophisticated Security

Safety against game piracy is imperative. Pluto 6 uses two-stage customer-specific security giving superior protection to your gaming application. A security chip and security software ensures that once your application is developed it is well and truly safeguarded.


Hopefully not of course (this may even be a recent development, and not be present on the older fruit machine hardware already deployed), and if the dev has a running game, then they may have already bypassed it... but might be a roadblock depending on how it's implemented etc.

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3 hours ago, johnparker007 said:

I wonder if they may have more security outside of the Pluto 6 'core' emulation; from the Heber website:
 

Sophisticated Security

Safety against game piracy is imperative. Pluto 6 uses two-stage customer-specific security giving superior protection to your gaming application. A security chip and security software ensures that once your application is developed it is well and truly safeguarded.


Hopefully not of course (this may even be a recent development, and not be present on the older fruit machine hardware already deployed), and if the dev has a running game, then they may have already bypassed it... but might be a roadblock depending on how it's implemented etc.

It sounds like some manufacturers never utilised it (reflex) so it might be possible to bypass it, well time will tell of course.

J

 

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A quick read on google, looks like they are able to be dumped.  I imagine the data is scrambled with the receiving end deciphering it?   I don't really know a lot about this kind of stuff.  I'm sure it won't just be as simple as dumping the data as it would seem a bit pointless if it is security.

J

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I am pretty sure these security chips cannot be read by normal means, they will have there security fuses blown, BUT as with all chips they can be done by company's using nitric acid and high powered microscopes! but that of course can cost £1000 for just one chip, and more if its a complex fpga, so if there is more than just one chip used for different machines (like mpu4 charactisers) it really makes it very uneconomical to do

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probably why mfme was never back ported back to mame I remember a convo I had years ago on how they got past these chips and how the debugger was used to bypass the chrs, basically the machine would ask for (example) the number 2 rather than emulate the chip and pass 2 to the machine they would feed it the number 2

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41 minutes ago, Altharic said:

probably why mfme was never back ported back to mame I remember a convo I had years ago on how they got past these chips and how the debugger was used to bypass the chrs, basically the machine would ask for (example) the number 2 rather than emulate the chip and pass 2 to the machine they would feed it the number 2

yes so if you know what the machine is asking for you can program a chip to give those answers to the mpu, its how i did mpu5 security chips in real machines, but took me 6 months and more to do it

Edited by andrew96
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and sadly why Pluto might be stumbled they like straight emulation and no workarounds unless its something they like and are interested in saw a full PR get binned the other day no help just criticism so the guy just went fuck this and walked understandable IMO

 

https://github.com/mamedev/mame/pull/13264

Edited by Altharic
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20 hours ago, Altharic said:

and sadly why Pluto might be stumbled they like straight emulation and no workarounds unless its something they like and are interested in saw a full PR get binned the other day no help just criticism so the guy just went fuck this and walked understandable IMO

 

https://github.com/mamedev/mame/pull/13264

Wow, a lot of work there for it just to get cancelled :(

Sadly there are quite a few folk who won't even consider contributing to MAME because of the difficulty of getting stuff approved.

 

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Not strictly fme but could be now gas a recompiler that means a big speed increase for demanding systems I can see them adding more if this lot works

1.21 Updated to MAME 0.274 which adds a 64-bit ARMv8 recompiler (DRC). This means a huge performance boost on very demanding systems like K.Instinct or CPS-3. Support 16 KB page sizes so that new Android devices will work.

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