Cheating or Tight Fisted ?

[AK45]

Hi i have been back recording many videos and uploading to my channel I havent uploaded them here as i didnt want to spam the video section and bury all of degsys vids anyway to the matter at hand i usually put a few quid through the machines to make sure it does something when i record and pays some sort of money out but i have come across this machine from DAD which is "Random Gold Double Up" it is 35 or 70 jackpot depending on the stake thats played (i play the 70) so i started putting cash in when the meters read about 2000 in and 1300 out, I am now on 9170 in and the same 1300 out it just hasnt paid anything at all whether i let the machine play or i do it myself ??

Edited January 15, 2023 by AK45

[WonkySausage]

Not sure if it's an emulator thing but these concept games seem to play really shit. They hover around 50% payout then streak like mad - that said, I used to let auto start do its thing and I wonder if that changes anything. 

So like, say on autostart, you get 3 nudges and there's the jackpot symbol 3 nudges away, autostart would go for that. But playing manually and going for the lower symbols seemed to flash holds after nudges a few times. 

No idea how you're gonna get that back to %age as the £70 version is locked at 86%! I dunno if you've had it on start up as well - if the machine flashes all the lamps and beeps at you quickly, it's ram reset itself - which was annoying as i'd put nearly a grand through it in the previous session only for it to do this the next time I fired it up to chase what i'd put in! It's a rare bug that's happened say once or twice in the time i've had it, but yeah really sucked when it happened

Edited January 15, 2023 by WonkySausage

[WonkySausage]

post the ram file and see if anyone can get it anywhere near %age lol

[slotsmagic]

1 hour ago, AK45 said:

Hi i have been back recording many videos and uploading to my channel I havent uploaded them here as i didnt want to spam the video section and bury all of degsys vids anyway to the matter at hand i usually put a few quid through the machines to make sure it does something when i record and pays some sort of money out but i have come across this machine from DAD which is "Random Gold Double Up" it is 35 or 70 jackpot depending on the stake thats played (i play the 70) so i started putting cash in when the meters read about 2000 in and 1300 out, I am now on 9170 in and the same 1300 out it just hasnt paid anything at all whether i let the machine play or i do it myself ??

They are a brutal game - I generally quite like them but don't like getting too involved. I'd rather get involved on standard Electrocoin, or a Concept 3 win plan game.

Even if the machine is in a completely crap part of it's sequence, I'd still expect some wins - if it's like the normal Random Gold you'd still get the odd Cherry or standard XXX win every so often. I'll confess I've never played the Double Up but I'm sure it's the same.

I'm sure there must be different profiles of Random Gold as the one near me - while brutal - isn't as bad as some horror stories I've heard.

Are you certain it's not paid any wins? It could be the meters are knackered, or doing that thing some machines do where the meters only correct themselves when you exit and reload the layout?

Edited January 15, 2023 by slotsmagic

[AK45]

1 hour ago, slotsmagic said:

Are you certain it's not paid any wins? It could be the meters are knackered, or doing that thing some machines do where the meters only correct themselves when you exit and reload the layout?

I have reloaded many times after putting in 50 credits and it just dosent give a win and the meter is now over 9200 and still no win. I havent tried the 35 jackpot stake so maybe thats worth a go for a few 100 credits

[slotsmagic]

6 hours ago, AK45 said:

I have reloaded many times after putting in 50 credits and it just dosent give a win and the meter is now over 9200 and still no win. I havent tried the 35 jackpot stake so maybe thats worth a go for a few 100 credits

I'm intrigued now!

I had a chat with an ex-Concept programmer recently and (while a different machine) each stake had it's own sequence - the stakes were independent. So I doubt that'll make a difference but might be worth a shot!

As @WonkySausage says above, might be worth uploading the RAM and GAM file (zipped up) so we can see what's going on

[Sarkymark77]

Good plan, I always think that’s a great idea when someone comes across something unusual, share it and see if anyone can break it!

[WonkySausage]

i fired this up earlier, ram reset it and put £100 in and it took £90 to drop cherries that doubled, held with no double. That was the first win  -  i let auto start do most of the credits on this one.

Ram reset it a 2nd time and it's  playing a lot better, but this time I'd refilled the coins in Hopper 1 to £200. I kept playing past £100 this time too to £160 and it's paid out £120 (running at 74% - about 12% behind) but as I was playing manually, when I got 3 nudges and 2 jackpot  symbols  could be left on the reels for a potential hold after nudges, I ignored  them and went for lower symbols, with some  success, not  great, but some nonetheless!

Both times  were on 50p stake. I do wish I knew how to access the internal stats for money in and out on this so I could see if anything was amiss

Edited January 16, 2023 by WonkySausage

[AK45]

11 hours ago, WonkySausage said:

post the ram file and see if anyone can get it anywhere near %age lol

Random Gold Double Up (Concept).gamRandom Gold Double Up (Concept).ram

Edited January 16, 2023 by AK45

[WonkySausage]

@AK45 So already something's not right as when you tick refill, it says the hopper is empty in yours, even though it's 700 quid behind haha.

MIne's on the left, which from ram reset I refilled with £200, yours is on the right. I'm still gonna give it a go and see what happens, will report back later

Edited January 16, 2023 by WonkySausage

[WonkySausage]

Edit: Post deleted as my claim about the gam file  being read only affecting the ram, appears to not be the case as i've just tried with another machine (making the gam file  read only) and it remember where it was at  when reloaded  -  though i'm certain i've had an issue where a layout was read only and wasn't keeping track of where it's at - unless the ram file itself had been made read only haha. Sorry about the confusion.

There's still something borked with your ram though, or why would it show it as empty   playing now and will report back

Edited January 16, 2023 by WonkySausage

[WonkySausage]

So I've put £134 through it, to win £5. And what I thought above, about the gam file being read only is nonsense because I closed down the layout, reloaded it and the hopper is showing £129 in it, so it's remember my session. I also thought because the ram and gam file names were different to the fml, that might have been causing an issue, but yeah, that don't seem to be it either.

So I've no clue, other than - the ram you posted seems to think it's had nothing through it for some bizarre reason and can only assume it's either corrupt (but still doesn't make sense why it remembered my £134 session though) or the game has randomly ram reset itself on start up - which i've had before on this and that poundstretcher game. Sorry I couldn't be of more help, hopefully someone else might know  

 

Edited January 16, 2023 by WonkySausage

[andrew96]

well don't put out of your mind that the emulator is just that, it emulates the hardware which might not be a exact emulation, therefore there could well be differences between real and emulated hardware. We sadly will never know with the passing of Chris, but back when he was around someone would find a problem and he would fix it, so to me it says that things could still be discovered but will now not get fixed

[andrew96]

Has someone on here got the real machine that can test the roms and see what it is like?

[slotsmagic]

44 minutes ago, andrew96 said:

Has someone on here got the real machine that can test the roms and see what it is like?

Afraid not, I'd love a Random Gold but haven't got one yet, and I feel the Double Up is a rarer version. No idea if the ROMs could just be plopped into a normal Electrocoin board or if you'd need a different security chip to go with it.

[andrew96]

27 minutes ago, slotsmagic said:

Afraid not, I'd love a Random Gold but haven't got one yet, and I feel the Double Up is a rarer version. No idea if the ROMs could just be plopped into a normal Electrocoin board or if you'd need a different security chip to go with it.

ah so if it has a security chip then that I think is likely to have an affect on play that could possibly not be accounted for in emulation (as the security chip has not been cracked), that's what I think

[Tommy c]

There is deffo an issue somewhere, these concepts normally float pretty much at % with a little swing here and there. They can be brutal from a ram clear but nowhere near that bad.

[Tommy c]

There is a box or.something to select the security chip version can't quite remember now but the security for concept was sorted, not for electrocoin which was a big shame. 

[WonkySausage]

Welp.. I just fired this up to play again.. and low and behold all the lamps were flashing and the machine was beeping at me with an  error on the 7seg, so the game has just ram reset itself. Annoyed as i'm  back to square one - even though the meters are showing  £200 in for  £120 out - hoppers  are showing  0 in them  and as the game  booted, was  showing Clr on the  7 seg. I reckon this must have happened to you at some point @AK45

Thing is, this ain't  the first time it's happened to me so it's getting frustrating keep having to go back to 0 in and out.

Edited January 16, 2023 by WonkySausage

[serene02]

These are extremely brutal from ram reset for some reason.  There is one in a local arcade with a flat battery and a Magic 7 with a flat battery, you can hammer the Electrocoin every day if you wanted.  I wouldn’t touch a ram reset Concept programme.

J

[serene02]

Trouble with the local arcade in question is that they only float hoppers with about 30 quid, so a massive pain to get involved, not a smooth session as i used to do the Magic7 and even when they refloat they literally put max 50, too much hassle as you can easily make a ton on a ram reset if you play it out!!

J

Edited January 16, 2023 by serene02

[Cavey]

21 minutes ago, serene02 said:

These are extremely brutal from ram reset for some reason.  There is one in a local arcade with a flat battery and a Magic 7 with a flat battery, you can hammer the Electrocoin every day if you wanted.  I wouldn’t touch a ram reset Concept programme.

J

Meh. I reckon that flat battery was left like that "by accident" lol.

Perpetually RAM resetting machine always in start up suck mode, day in and day out (complete with "80% payout or greater" sticker?) Sounds like a very easy way to site a de facto very low % machine to me. Surely not. 

[AK45]

2 hours ago, WonkySausage said:

all the lamps were flashing and the machine was beeping at me with an  error

Yes that did happen to me so i hit CTRL+R reset the machine and all was good even the meter count stayed as it was and didnt reset to zero, Im glad its not just me thinking it was a bit odd lol

 

Thankyou guys for all the input and suggestions 

Edited January 16, 2023 by AK45

[WonkySausage]

17 minutes ago, AK45 said:

Yes that did happen to me so i hit CTRL+R reset the machine and all was good even the meter count stayed as it was and didnt reset to zero, Im glad its not just me thinking it was a bit odd lol

 

Thankyou guys for all the input and suggestions 

I guarantee it's ram reset itself, whether its an emulator issue or the ram is getting corrupted when you exit mfme somehow - the meters in MFME don't necessarily correspond with what's on the internal meters.

Say with the ram you posted - there's no way the machine is £700 behind and the hopper is showing as empty

Edited January 16, 2023 by WonkySausage

[slotsmagic]

6 hours ago, serene02 said:

Trouble with the local arcade in question is that they only float hoppers with about 30 quid, so a massive pain to get involved, not a smooth session as i used to do the Magic7 and even when they refloat they literally put max 50, too much hassle as you can easily make a ton on a ram reset if you play it out!!

J

Had that today on Random Gold in the local, £10 in for £250 odd out. Only thing is they only float with £100... so had to refill it 3 times for me. With a mech that doesn't accept 2016 onwards £1 coins. Took bloody ages, but then I let them off, had a decent roll on the Bar X 7even and the Diamond 7 both times while waiting.

Recorded it doing a let 'em spin on £70 and stopped recording before the first IOU. Didn't have a jackpot hold but had another jackpot shortly after and I'm pretty sure another one... If not it's my memory playing up. in any case it was a decent result.

(Sod it, here's the shit clip I took. As per the title ignore the creepy gloves, I have to wear them due to coin allergies.

https://youtube.com/shorts/5eCFisZ7gbI?feature=share )

It's a strictly no phone arcade and I don't want to piss them off!

Random Gold is a brutal machine - so I play it like a lottery. Few quid here or there, hope it kicks off a streak, if not then walk. You can't get involved in chasing them. I mean I have, but it's never ended well, so it takes discipline to walk away, which I do now. There's a few indicators that it's warming up. I find the hardest thing is knowing when to walk when it's on a run!

Edited January 16, 2023 by slotsmagic