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My "consecutive losing spins" experiment


TheSecondLugia
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I know this is not a good strategy of winning the jackpot on a fruit machine, but because I'm bored, I decided to see how many losing spins the machine can handle on max bet before it forces itself to pay the money.

What I did here is basically the opposite of the common method of playing: not holding or nudging a winning combination or a feature combination, trying to not win anything from the feature (even when its on GATW), and doing the gamble until I get nothing or the jackpot. If the feature is GATW, I find a way to get out of it without winning anything (like losing the repeat space gamble or taking the feature that has a chance of not paying anything).

These machines are played at the max stake.

Notable results

DOND The Crazy Chair/The Big Deal/CYBTB etc. (BFM) - After playing as much as 800 times in each machine and not winning anything (even on Go All The Ways), my next feature entries will always be GATW. On some machines like DOND Mega, it will respin to 3 bells (which pays the jackpot).

It's Amazing (Barcrest) - After over 150 spins, the machine resets and gives a critical error message.

Showtime (Reflex) - About 300 spins. When I tried escaping the GATW by losing on the repeat space gamble after getting the next number hint, it displayed that I won the gamble, even though the number landed would result in a game over.

Pie Factory (Vivid) - About 40 pounds in the 15/0.30 version for it to start the "always GATW" mode. However, I can easily exit the feature by landing on Lose during the skill stop. It's uncommon for the machine to not give this opportunity.

The Simpsons (Maygay) - About 20 pounds in the 15/0.30 version. I had to be lucky to land on the skill stop space where I can stop on the losing space when the feature round has invincibility.

Reno Reels (BWB) - About 30 pounds in before the machines gives out nudges for every spin. That streak ended when I landed on 3 blue 7s for 4 quid. Getting a Bust in the feature spins takes forever too.

Monopoly Road to Riches (Mazooma) - About 300 spins before it spun the jackpot and puts the jackpot amount in the Safe so that I am guaranteed to win that amount.

Invincible (Red) - Literally takes forever.

 

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Believe it or not, but the method you explained above is exactly how "professional" fruit machine players usually play machines. Barcrests are a prime example of machines that are worth forcing for jackpot. On some machines there will be a certain feature that pays jackpot which can be obtained before the machine is ready to give a GATW board.

Your result on Barcrest It's Amazing is interesting. Usually the Barcrest critical error pops up when the machine has gone way over percentage or paid out too much. Never seen it error like this when it's been forced. If you force Psycho Cash Beast or Frenzy on the early program, you will find the bonus starts on taxi or skillstop on feature entry. 

On Pie Factory there is a high up feature called Upper Crust where you have to hit the flashing buttons. Just don't hit the right button and you can lose. 

On The Simpsons the "pros" method back in the day is collect £1 on the red board. It will still keep spinning in the feature which will be red, so keep collecting £1 until the feature spin in is normal. Then it goes on a £60 or £75 run. 

Monopoly Road To Riches was an interesting result. A lot of JPM machines will spin the jackpot straight in when they have been forced. JPMs are an example of a machine where it's best to collect wins though.

 

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I like to see the emulator used in different ways.

Some of my mates, say what's the point, you can't win or lose money.

But I always say, that a lot of machines are like old video games, where they are just fun to play particularly for the £4-£8 era.

Even some of the machines from the £25 era, can still offer multiple way of getting a jackpot and it's fun, trying to set up Nudge to the Nearest Win, or Tutti Frutti in red mode, to give a jackpot.

I quite often, also give myself an imaginary limited balance to play and either play the machine, as I would taking wins here or there and see if I end up with a profit. Or seeing if I can get a jackpot before the money runs out.

Last time I played MPU4 Take Two on 20p £4.80 jackpot and played until I forced it to give either the jackpot or a Money Maker £2.40 which repeated. I couldn't believe I was £30 in, before it finally gave me the Money Maker which repeated. So £25 down on a £4.80 machine.

Edited by wearecity
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Knocking back invincible boards has been a common trick down the years. It's something a programmer might not expect, and therefore not adequately protect the machine from.

Lotta Luck and its clones are well known examples. Another one I can remember is Space Invaders by Crystal - flat profile normally, but knock back a few invincible boards and it can go on a 4 jackpot run.

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If you don't collect anything on Battle Axe, Revolution and clones, then the board will start 3 or 4 features up like it does on  run after a jackpot.

As you found out with DOND Mega it will start offering £100 (the bells) if you don't collect anything. Also it should just shoot Mega Streak on the shots. This is kind of a separate pot. 

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1 hour ago, logopolis said:

As you found out with DOND Mega it will start offering £100 (the bells) if you don't collect anything. Also it should just shoot Mega Streak on the shots. This is kind of a separate pot. 

Interesting. This is probably an overspill pot, and only gets released once both current and overspill pot are maxed out. Otherwise the overspill money probably just gets transferred elsewhere once current pot is depleted.

I think this is why brute forcing many Bellfruits was a bad idea. A lot of the money just got squirreled away and paid out much, much later.

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I'm glad you thought forcing is the professional way of playing the fruit machines lol.

I started using this strategy on Son of Dracula (£5/30p), and it gave me an invincible board and unlimited nudges on mystery bonuses after around £50 in. I have stuck to this strategy ever since. I did achieve a lot of successes in forcing a jackpot (such as Card Sharks that gave over £130 despite it being a £5 jackpot) as well as a lot of failures (like fruit machines from Red).

Recently, I did the losing streak on a 3-player Golden Game from Mazooma (£25/30p), and the machine is begging me to nudge a feature game after around 250 spins. Same thing goes for Monopoly Wheel of Wealth (£35/50p).

Star Paws (Betcom) had an invincibility on the cash ladder gamble and on the feature board. It took me £200 to trigger invincibility, What's funny was that when I landed on the hint space, the hint would always be "DO OR DO NOT WILL BE THERE IS NO TRY".

Most Daunting £25/30p (Extreme gaming) was a weird one. After £35 in, it sorta gave a GATW board (since every repeat space gamble resulted in a win), but I still landed on Lose after some dice rolls.

Nifty Fifty £25/30p (Project) gave me nudges on almost every spin after £35. However, none of these nudges gave me the top feature and instead nudge to a £2 win (diamonds) or a £5 win (bars). My losing streak here is pretty long, and I've put over £100 in that machine.

Bullion Bars £35/30p (Astra) is pretty much a disaster for me. After around 300 losing spins, it finally spun a Bullion Bar feature and... I only won £5.

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Card Shark being a Vivid is definitely a force machine. However, with Vivids there are 2 separate pots you are building up. These are the cash wins and the feature board. With Card Shark there are several different pots. One of them is a "free win" jackpot. 

On Golden Game there is a pro players method where you knock back any top boards until the machine flashes golden x or offers nudges for it every credit or so. This is what's known as the repeat pot. On £25 jackpot the big repeat pot is usually £85 but it can give less like £35 or £40. Also this repeat pot doesn't affect the hold after nudge for golden game. So you should find after forcing for the repeat pot, the machine will offer you hold after nudge for golden game. 

Monopoly Wheel of Wealth has a streak pot that will eventually come round. If you don't take it, then it will keep offering every credit until you take it. It will give Mega Streak on the wheel. 

Betcoms are the ultimate force machines of recent times. The Mega Streak will give either £100 or £150, it seems to be totally random which amount it will give. Some can't give £150 though, such as Popeye, and Baking Bad which is a clone of Star Paws.

Most Daunting and clones such as Round The Bend and Doctors And Nurses have certain setups where you can obtain frequent features so it's best to collect wins. You can force them for jackpot but it's really not worth it. On the early programs, you could get on the board every time it feature held by using a refill key!

Most Astra lo techs can't be forced. Especially Bullion Bars. Take what you can on these.

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Astra's can be forced but their pay/streak cycle is massive and rather unpredictable.  I've seen Party Times and Party Games go hundreds with no decent boards or wins then another time I've seen a single unit being refloated a couple of times as they are into their big payout cycle.

J

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On 22/06/2021 at 00:14, TheSecondLugia said:

Reno Reels (BWB) - About 30 pounds in before the machines gives out nudges for every spin. That streak ended when I landed on 3 blue 7s for 4 quid. Getting a Bust in the feature spins takes forever too.

 

Not being a pro-player I don't have much to contribute to this thread, but just to say I have been playing the stunning A:E layout of Reno Reels a lot recently. If it's happy then it just won't land on Bust. If you get to the stage where you are forced on the feature never collect the super feature always go for Blackjack, as 9/10 times you can just keep twisting yourself into oblivion. Occasionally it will force a straight 21 on you which is autocollect but it is consistently the best way I have found to bin yourself off with no win. You can door open/close if a feature is forced but depends how it's forced. If it just spins straight in then after reset it will just spin in again so Blackjack is a good out.

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  • 10 months later...
43 minutes ago, Sarkymark77 said:

Is there a mega streak anywhere on star paws? Is it on the dond bonus gamble wheel??

Yes. It's the Streak Walker feature art the bottom left of the top glass, earned by filling all the paws. 

It's capped at £100 though, which is rather dull as it usually costs at least that. 

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8 minutes ago, Boulderdash said:

Yes. It's the Streak Walker feature art the bottom left of the top glass, earned by filling all the paws. 

It's capped at £100 though, which is rather dull as it usually costs at least that. 

Unless you can trap it from add again!

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On 22/06/2021 at 11:30, wearecity said:

I like to see the emulator used in different ways.

Some of my mates, say what's the point, you can't win or lose money.

But I always say, that a lot of machines are like old video games, where they are just fun to play particularly for the £4-£8 era.

Even some of the machines from the £25 era, can still offer multiple way of getting a jackpot and it's fun, trying to set up Nudge to the Nearest Win, or Tutti Frutti in red mode, to give a jackpot.

I quite often, also give myself an imaginary limited balance to play and either play the machine, as I would taking wins here or there and see if I end up with a profit. Or seeing if I can get a jackpot before the money runs out.

Last time I played MPU4 Take Two on 20p £4.80 jackpot and played until I forced it to give either the jackpot or a Money Maker £2.40 which repeated. I couldn't believe I was £30 in, before it finally gave me the Money Maker which repeated. So £25 down on a £4.80 machine.

Now that's my fme guilty pleasure there... it's soooo much fun compared to being skint hahaha.. that should be some kind of header on the site to help people really enjoy themselves

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living the dream

 

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  • 2 months later...
On 22/06/2021 at 11:49, Dougsta said:

Knocking back invincible boards has been a common trick down the years. It's something a programmer might not expect, and therefore not adequately protect the machine from.

Lotta Luck and its clones are well known examples. Another one I can remember is Space Invaders by Crystal - flat profile normally, but knock back a few invincible boards and it can go on a 4 jackpot run.

We never cared about, and never coded for, collecting in red boards. You don't need to. The compensator will just have a high value and the logic will do its job next time around. Read my thread about how compensators worked for more info.

Some games, mainly lo-techs, would shovel money around to create streaks or maybe carve a bit of money out of the main compensator to fund smaller mini streaks (see Golden Oldie for that) but hi-tech AWPs, certainly from Mazooma and BFG, would never bother. At some point, someone will collect the money and all will be well. If they don't, the compensator can hold a maximum 2147483647 pence so you'd need to play a long long time for it to overflow.... 🤣

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On 22/06/2021 at 00:14, TheSecondLugia said:

 

Invincible (Red) - Literally takes forever.

 

funny, i've been playing Paint the Town Red (10p/£5/88%) and whilst i'm playing far from the optimum way to play as I don't really know how to play many hi tech machines - this game just takes and takes and takes and is already so far behind % from RAM reset I don't even know if or how it will get to its target %age. At one point it was running at 35% and have currently managed to get it to 55ish... £163 in for £88 out. It's actually starting to piss me off haha - more than reflexes do and thats saying something because I hate reflexes. These Red's are punishing and they don't even hide just how bent and rigged they are haha

Edited by WonkySausage
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On 22/06/2021 at 18:05, TheSecondLugia said:

Most Daunting £25/30p (Extreme gaming) was a weird one. After £35 in, it sorta gave a GATW board (since every repeat space gamble resulted in a win), but I still landed on Lose after some dice rolls.

Nifty Fifty £25/30p (Project) gave me nudges on almost every spin after £35. However, none of these nudges gave me the top feature and instead nudge to a £2 win (diamonds) or a £5 win (bars). My losing streak here is pretty long, and I've put over £100 in that machine.

 

Most daunting willl flash on a true GATW board.

Nifty fifty is just evil - cos when it does give the £25...... its anywhere from £25 to £200! So it needs to build it up........

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53 minutes ago, WonkySausage said:

funny, i've been playing Paint the Town Red (10p/£5/88%) and whilst i'm playing far from the optimum way to play as I don't really know how to play many hi tech machines - this game just takes and takes and takes and is already so far behind % from RAM reset I don't even know if or how it will get to its target %age. At one point it was running at 35% and have currently managed to get it to 55ish... £163 in for £88 out. It's actually starting to piss me off haha - more than reflexes do and thats saying something because I hate reflexes. These Red's are punishing and they don't even hide just how bent and rigged they are haha

I once got my arse handed to me by a Red Vortex on 10p/£5 on a holiday camp. I think part of the issue was my playing mega spins and pretty much just forcing for tops. I honestly think I was £90 down by the time I'd given up, which is insanity for a £5 jackpot - but then I was playing it in a bonkers way.

Looking back I'd probably just stick to 10p normal spins and try and extract the value rather than forcing on the most volatile setting.

I don't believe that the previous player had done anything to it, just my stupidity and ignorance :D

 

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Currently owned digitals : T7 Encore, T7 Original, Astra iPub and Storm Street Casino.

MFME cabinets : Genesis cab DIY by No1Stoney, Interplay conversion and Vegas Strip conversion (both are works in progress!)

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16 minutes ago, slotsmagic said:

I once got my arse handed to me by a Red Vortex on 10p/£5 on a holiday camp. I think part of the issue was my playing mega spins and pretty much just forcing for tops. I honestly think I was £90 down by the time I'd given up, which is insanity for a £5 jackpot - but then I was playing it in a bonkers way.

Looking back I'd probably just stick to 10p normal spins and try and extract the value rather than forcing on the most volatile setting.

I don't believe that the previous player had done anything to it, just my stupidity and ignorance :D

 

was gonna say most reds you just force right, but in the same breath, there must be some where you just take the value as you say. The thing is, this game almost seems too predictable as to when its going to kill you off, so maybe i'll just collect stuff and see where I end up. Just in case i've fucked it up somehow, i've ram reset again - £46 in so far for £24 out - just had a top feature with x2 repeats for £15 plus a few last orders which forced wins on me

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1 hour ago, WonkySausage said:

funny, i've been playing Paint the Town Red (10p/£5/88%) and whilst i'm playing far from the optimum way to play as I don't really know how to play many hi tech machines - this game just takes and takes and takes and is already so far behind % from RAM reset I don't even know if or how it will get to its target %age. At one point it was running at 35% and have currently managed to get it to 55ish... £163 in for £88 out. It's actually starting to piss me off haha - more than reflexes do and thats saying something because I hate reflexes. These Red's are punishing and they don't even hide just how bent and rigged they are haha

Cos Red's dont have a flash board, you can really knock them back...... just for giggles last week i put £300 through Holy Moley (50p mega spins £35) without collecting anything.

You sure can have fun afterwards though getting the value back out - and (on larger JP's at least) you can get it back to percentage.....

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