Mort
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Posts posted by Mort
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Good news we do have Series 5, is this of interest ? If so, I can check DX is all OK and then upload ?
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Yeah just looked at my RC DXs. I have £10 on Series 9, £8 on Series 2, £15 on Series 11A and £5 on Series 28!
I would think I set it up like this because we have no earlier £10 ROMs, but I will take a look later this evening just in case!
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I do have the Series 8 ROM running (standard profile, £10 ROM) I thought I posted and talked about this before, can't remember.
Do you want me to upload it ?
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11 hours ago, wearecity said:
Ah it was Retrofruit
Unfortunately because it was too easy to just force a JP from several Maygay clubbers by hi-lo gamble on a reel win, they introduced a £25 block on the gamble that you couldn't ever get past regardless of happiness or number. Sad really. They could have gone the BFM route which was to allow hi-lo on the printed values and block the variable ones. By that I mean if you look at something like Cops and Robbers club, there are fixed (printed) values then the top of the trail has blacked out values that were only lit depending on the prize level. Typically the printed values went to £50 or £75 max. Eventually when BFM's are happy enough you can break through the printed ceiling, then it pretty much doesn't matter what number you gamble on.
Yep remember speaking with @Retrofruit about the unfortunate £25 block which was imposed by Maygay on the Club Coronation Street M1A machine with the v1.1 ROM. Unfortunately we never got hold of v1.0 which didn't have this block. Whilst I loved many things about Maygay machines, especially the themes and samples, I didn't think too much of their programming skills on some machines. Classic examples are the likes of Italian Job and Great Escape, such wonderful themed machines, but when you understand what the code is doing, it's utterly lazy and boring, compare that to the gameplay variance of the likes of a JPM such as Fast Trak.
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8 hours ago, Projectgilda said:
I don't know if it was a thing or not. But other manufacturers weren't so daft as to put only £1's in. Like I said earlier, we tested with various denominations, letting it go out of credit for a couple of minutes, leaving part credits in nothing was left to chance. So even if it was a thing it wouldn't have kicked in the way we play tested other companies products.
Thanks for confirming what I thought with respect to any proper stats play testing would use all inputs and different styles of play. The more I think about it, it doesn't really make much sense, but another bit of history about fruit machine development to understand and from my point of view to take that information to make playing MFME more exact. We spent far too many years in FME just using £1 input exclusively.
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9 hours ago, Cavey said:
I reckon the worst clubbers were Maygays. Absolute crap IMO.
I didn't want to agree with this, but over the years of playing them, I, unfortunately, have to agree.
I always loved a Maygay AWP, well... before Epoch of course!
The clubbers had such boring gameplay.
Nice to see you around Cavey btw.
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1 hour ago, Projectgilda said:
Red games had board values set to them (as with all compensated machine). But if you lost, that amount was put in a pot. Chances were that you'd get offered the same, but usually more, next feature. And it continued. If you played to lose you'd be given generous boards. It kept players on the machines as they knew their lost money would be offered time and time again. Pots were illegal by that time. The state of a game couldn't be dictated by previous games other than general compensation. Saving players activities was illegal.
In my completely naïve playing days, that's exactly how I expected feature boards to work.
What's your opinions on stats play Andrew ? I said earlier today that I can't understand how another manufacturer would not be inputting different coins anyway. I understand if you can't comment, I just don't get this £1 only anti-stat's mode the more I think and mull it over.
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I remember my uni days, a couple of us played the machines constantly when we had the cash, and then a run out to the local spa shop for some ready to eat chicken and £30 cashback multiple times (back then they had no checks against your bank balance, or, at least, that's the way I understood it, when I found out I was thousands over my overdraft limit!)
Anyway, another chap in our friendship group would only use a bit of the shrapnel from paying for his pint, he always did well generally, and most importantly would not continue regardless of winning or losing - he would just stick to that loose shrapnel which he could always afford to lose.
I wish I'd been more like him, but I don't think he had the addiction side of personality like the rest of us did. I've always been intense, like to understand everything etc. and get very invested in topics which interest me. It's all fired by an addictive personality.
I'd say at uni, where I played the machines the most, there were more normal players like him and us addicts in the minority.
There was a 'pro' player back then I recall, guy called Adrian/Adey/Addy, often used to find him playing in the quieter hours, the in-between times when the machines were on but the bar closed - 'hoovering' all our lost money out of the tubes no doubt.
Ridiculous situation when you look back on it with hindsight.
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@johnparker007 did work in the Arcade Simulator to speed up these boot up initialisation routines iirc but when using MFME normally you are out of luck I'm afraid, as @dondplayer says Cheat Engine is your only real option.
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16 minutes ago, Boulderdash said:
Why does it have to have human intelligence?
AI (LLMs) can mimic human thought and even generate art that looks creative, but that’s all surface-deep. It doesn’t experience anything, so it doesn’t really understand beauty, emotion, or meaning. Human consciousness isn’t just about output, it’s about what it feels like to see, hear, or create. That’s something no machine can touch.
Honestly I wish they hadn't 'branded' it as AI, should have just called it LLM from the outset.
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I’ve been thinking about all the AI stuff coming out lately. People love to argue about whether they’re “intelligent” or if they could ever be conscious. But I feel like most of these conversations completely skip over what’s actually the hardest part: consciousness itself.
The hard problem of consciousness isn’t about processing data, writing text, or even acting like a human. It’s about experience. Why does anything feel like something at all? Why does red look red to us? Why does thinking feel like thinking?
We’ve made huge progress in understanding the brain and building AI LLM models that can do human-like stuff. But we have no idea how, or if, we could explain consciousness, let alone recreate it. Honestly, it’s possible humans will never solve it, because we’re trying to understand it from the inside of our own experience.
So when people talk about AI “waking up” or becoming conscious, I think we need to be careful. AI can pretend to act aware, generate text, even sound reflective but that inner experience is still completely unknown.
LLMs are amazing, but consciousness? That’s still humanity’s biggest and I think unsolvable mystery.
The AI we talk about is just Google 2.0, nothing more. It's a hype bubble, but it's brilliant for making my job easier that's for sure!
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2 hours ago, vectra666 said:
Rockets are so last century id give it 100 years max and we’ll travelling to the edge of this galaxy or should I say the robots will
its only a matter of time and time is an illusion made up by mankind to give us order out of chaos.
is there life on other planets, he’ll yes millions of them, most of which are thinking the same as us “this betcom is rigged to hell , shove another credit in it might change?”
back on subject lol
Don't worry, the aliens are already on the way
https://futurism.com/astronomer-interstellar-object-alien-turing-test
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In simple terms, as many of us appreciate, compensated machines were just broken. For any machine to be perfect then it needs to avoid the inherent human nature issue of greed. In hindsight, it just comes down to this (the below, from the film WarGames, refers to nuclear war, but the same thing applies, the inherent human condition of greed)
Greed is on all sides of the equation here, manufacturer leaders, pub/club owners and pro players.
The losers are the many of us on here, the 'numpty' players who had no idea, and who have kept an emotional attachment and have the many losses and scars to show it.
The thing is though, the human issue of greed continues in many areas of life to this day.
If only we had known this at the time, but it's too late for that now, the only way to tackle it now is to stop gambling completely, that's the control we all still have now.
Hopefully what comes out of all the excellent research that @Chopaholic does, and the amazing work @Wizard and all other members of this scene have done over the years will prevent some of us from gambling completely, that's the way to really win here.
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18 minutes ago, Projectgilda said:
Thanks Mort for your response. Rollercoaster was originally a £6/£3. This was what I initially designed and where it played it's best. Personally this was my favourite stake to prize ratio. I could give you a great game with lots of frequency and skill features that weren't too restrained. £8/£4 handled my games well, but £15 was difficult for the older machines to handle. You need to design from scratch for £15. A more gambling experience. £35 fucked it for everyone, particularly me who wanted to create games as opposed to pure gaming machines. Cash Attack 2 and Psycho Cash Beast 2 were my only successful machines of that era. I left the industry shortly after.
Thanks for the response. It's great to have it fully confirmed that it started out on £6. The £6/£3 RC ROM is one of those holy grail ROMs. It's not out of our reach to hack the win table for the earliest £8/£4 ROM we have to put it back to £6/£3 but I'm not sure if this would be enough to make the machine fully aware of that change and to behave in the same way as the original £6/£3. It's something I have on my list of things to try one day anyway.
I originally started out enjoying the club machines available in FME, being a club player back in the day, but I much prefer and appreciate the golden AWP games of the £6 era nowadays.
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Glad you joined here Andrew, I hope that you can see the level of enthusiasm that's been key in this community over the past 25 years or so. FME is so niche, that we have been very fortunate to have some genius coders involved with our community who have provided us with the goodies to be able to create the level of emulation we can all enjoy now. After the coding genius of them, it's then been the job of the other creative geniuses to weave their magic in creating the classic and then graphical 'DX' layouts we all enjoy now.
Wizard was the main genius who coded MFME, he passed way, which was a very real sadness experienced by the community. We have had many other coding gods along the way as well, Dialtone for the original Impact emulator, JPeMu, ReAnimator for BFMulator (Scorpion 1 and 2 iirc), Guitar for an alternative MPU4 emulator written entirely in VBasic! (which introduced things like MUX strobing) and we are also fortunate to have the amazing @johnparker007 with us now who built Arcade Simulator, a 3D virtual arcade written in Unity, which uses MFME for the emulation.
We are all very interesed in emptiers and all that but we also welcome you with the opportunity to just tell us about the industry generally and openly, stories about working for JPM and Barcrest etc. Anything you can talk about, whilst it might seem non-interesting, would, I am sure, provide us with further insights and to understand the history, particularly on your side of the fence.
It's very rare for anyone in the industry to take the time to join our community, and I hope you find it a friendly place and can appreciate the amount of love that has been put in, over the many years, into making fruit machine emulation what it is today.
Oh and btw did Rollercoaster originally release on a £6 token ROM ? We have a flyer which shows it, and some have hazy memories of it, but it's never been 100% proven.
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The way to prove this, potentially, is to find the block of compensators in RAM and then put read breakpoints in MFME across this compensator range (to include lo-resolution ones as well, 1-6 etc.).
Play the base game as normal, and when number reel spins, if it's reading compensators each time, then it will break each time OR it may only read compensators every so often. In which case, just before a spin to 1 or 12, I would expect to see a break in code execution due to the read BPs you have set.
If the base game is separate to the feature game entirely, then it could just be reading compensators, to allow that initial gamble to be won in the base game (with no knowledge of the feature being JP ready). Which was always what I saw numbering to be. Is it true that when numbering you will always be guaranteed a jackpot win on the feature game (obviously with JPM that jackpot win could be under any JP capable feature, due to spread value) or if not, could it just be a by product effectively of the compensator read from the base game being high enough to allow the JP in the feature game _most_ of the time ?
Interesting stuff.
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Hi yes, they are the wrong way around. (thanks for the info, I have updated my version)
To correct this you just need to swap the lamp numbers around.
Design / Edit Mode
Right mouse click over the NO lamp, select Properties and change it to 153, then click Apply (see graphic below to help you)
Do the same for the YES lamp and change that to 137 and click Apply.
Then Design / Edit Mode to go back to normal play mode.
When you close the layout it will ask you to save those changes.
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If you want to see how far we have come, then I recommend Indiana Jones by Pook.
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Me and the missus keep talking about doing a cruise, we are getting to that time of life now !
Sounds great bud, well, except for the working part.
I normally tell people I'm going on holiday in a submarine at the bottom of the ocean, they get the hint then
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Was just thinking about it whilst posting on the Fruit Preserve thread and found a flyer image, thought I'd update the post. You never know we might get the ROM one day
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Causing a bit of a stir.
in Emulator Chat
Posted · Edited by Mort
Ok in case this helps you guys find out some more info.
Here is a collection of RC DXs.
both £10s are now on Series 05 (the earliest for £10 by the looks of it) - Token sensors appear OK. The Alt DX just has pre-lit reels (for a nicer effect).
£8 is on Series 02
£15 on Series 11A
£5 on Series 28
A wonderful collection of DXs by @Tommy c who is very much missed, and I hope he is OK.
I may well have made some changes to these DXs over the years to upgrade them for the later MFMEs, can't remember changes made, it's been a long time.
Edit - I think multi coin inputs have been added to all (9,8,7 etc.) and also main RC lamp blended across all DXs, that's all I can recall briefly looking at them.